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      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeDec 30th 2014 edited
     
    EDIT:
    This is now the thread for all the stuff I come up with.
    --------

    Hello everybody!

    I have been working on a rollercoaster I started very shortly after the release of NL2 after not using it in the last months due to work and other projects. But I thought it would be great to finish something someday... I've still got these other projects I had posted about but I figured it would be best to work on whatever I am the most motivated for at the moment.

    In relation to my "main project" (which means of all the things I am not working on, this one's lack of progress bugs me the most), this ones a bit smaller ;D

    It's only about 3,9 km/2.5 miles long and 75 m/245 ft high :D

    As you can read in the topic title, it's an Arrow 4D Coaster with 2 dueling tracks which are to be called Alpha and Omega. I think the 4D Coaster is amazing for a dueling coaster since you can control the riders viewing direction to create totally new and amazing racing/dueling effects. I have pushed the limits of what the arrow trains can handle and I haven't really taken more than a little inspiration from the existing 4Ds. So it's quite far from X2 and the others and it would most likely not be possible to build this with the existing version of the 4D technology without further revision. It's all about the 4D Dueling experience.

    I finished the trackwork now and I plan on doing a basic theming as well as a little environment tweaking and just try to keep it simple but athmospheric to allow the coasters to speak for themselves. I'm gonna try to work on it every now and then in my spare time. Let's hope I can manage to do so.

    That said, here's a few pictures for you, I hope you like it. And yeah, I have the trains move "backwards", which means the lighter grey thing is the front and the NL Logo is in the back.















    • CommentAuthorTheBeatles
    • CommentTimeDec 30th 2014
     
    Looks pretty nice, good luck with the supports
  1.  
    Yea, what beatles said. You'll need a lot of luck to support this coaster!
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      CommentAuthor6FlagsManiac
    • CommentTimeDec 30th 2014 edited
     
    Supports on this are going to be extremely tough and ugly if you want them to be realistic. I would strongly consider making the rides layout much more linear as apposed to the very free flowing one you have right now.
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      CommentAuthorbaadrix
    • CommentTimeDec 31st 2014
     
    Hey, nice to see you returning with another innovative project! I love the idea of a duelling 4D coaster, I hope you manage to squeeze in the most likely intricate support work somehow.

    Anyway, knowing (at least some of) your other projects I'm really looking forward to the final result of this one. ;)
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      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 1st 2015
     
    Wow, give me a break. I've done my share of research and I'm confident it can be done. Nobody said it's gonna be easy ;) I'll definately stick with this layout. You may see why one day.

    Thank you baadrix for the warm welcome back :)

    In the meantime, I've done some environment work and I decided to go with 2-tube track for the whole thing as it's done on Eejanaika with the 2 grades of tie-intervals to get the best stability. Since my trains are only 5 cars long, the stress naturally is not as high as it is on X2 (7 Cars) or Dinoconda (6 Cars).

    Here's the environment and Terrain I've done so far:











  2.  
    Oh man this has a lot of potential, and I'm loving the twisty bits I can make out. Can't wait to see what you come up with Zampano!
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      CommentAuthor6FlagsManiac
    • CommentTimeJan 1st 2015 edited
     
    You probobly shouldnt lock yourself into a 2 tube only mentality. 4D coasters switch to high stress track when there is an insuffient amount of supports on that particular track section. Also, when the track inverts it will usually switch to a one tube track. I don't think that removing 2 cars from the train makes as big of a difference as you seem to think, those cars are still all extremely heavy and the high stress track also increases stability of the ride to provide a smoother ride.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 1st 2015
     
    ^^ I'm glad you like it AJ :)

    ^If you take a closer look at Eejanaika, it uses only 2-tube track with low-stress track only in places where the track doesn't twist very much and the g's are very low. That's what you said about stability and a smooth right, twists also need the high stress track. Also 5 cars vs. 7 cars is like 30% less train weight, I think that's quite a difference. I didn't wan't to sound like that would be enough to only build half of the supports or something though. Eejanaika has 5 cars as well and I'm going to model my supports after it in terms of strength and spacing. That said I must say that your posts until now haven't had much content besides saying that I should just do it differently in general and to tell me that I'm wrong about stuff. I'm honestly glad about every piece of constructive criticism, and I also try to take everything into account - including your posts - but I really think you could be a little more polite and try to have a little more faith in my efforts to do it right. No offense, thank you :)
  3.  
    I really didn't mean for it to come out that way, so i apologize for that. I was tired when i wrote both comments so it may seem like rambling. I based most of what i said off of X2, mainly because i'm most familiar with it. I guess my main concern is areas of the track that have drawn out roll transitions as it seems i can spot a few. That is where you'll need a very creative mind when it comes to the supports, and i'm really hoping you can pull it off.

    All that said, i would argue that i have had the most constructive comments so far in this thread. To say that they lack content compared to the other comments in this thread seems a bit silly.

    Can't wait to see progress, cheers :^)
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 25th 2015
     
    A little update, I began to work on supports in the little time I could find for it and started in the back of the coaster. I'm gonna show the parts which are mostly finished by now, there's also a lot of WIP which I tried to not show in the screens. Tell me what you think :)







    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 29th 2015 edited
     
    Okay, here comes some more stuff, I'd be happy to hear your opinion!

    I'm trying to match the "weird" style of Arrow's 4D Supports while big parts of the layout are kind of different from the quitegeometric flow of the existing ones. I reworked details in the structure on the MCBR I showed in the last update, it should now match the style of the cross-beams more closely.

    Its still WIP though, big parts of the new structures dont have flanges yet.











  4.  
    ^Brett-Jones approves of these supports.

    I really like those supports.

    Those supports look nice.
    •  
      CommentAuthorKingRCT3
    • CommentTimeJan 29th 2015
     
    It's a really nice mess.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMorganFan
    • CommentTimeJan 29th 2015
     
    The single support after/before the brake run in the 4th picture looks weird. But that's just me. I absolutely love what you are doing!
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 30th 2015 edited
     
    ^ Thats already been taken care of :)
    •  
      CommentAuthorbaadrix
    • CommentTimeJan 30th 2015
     
    How on earth can you keep track of all those supports? Well, when I think about it ... I'm not wondering anymore - I've also seen other things from you. :P

    But seriously, this look really amazing so far. It might be a little expensive in real life, but hey, it's called NoLimits after all.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeFeb 16th 2015
     
    Beam by beam....

    About 2/3rds of the spaghetti parts are done I think. Plus I'm getting faster :)











    •  
      CommentAuthorBBSpeed26
    • CommentTimeFeb 16th 2015
     

    Have you given any thought on coloring the tracks individually? Not the supports, obviously, just the tracks. It looks absolutely mad, as-is, but it could be cool to see it with different colors, even if just for a test screen to give us construction-followers a peek at which layout is which.

    •  
      CommentAuthorDonidia
    • CommentTimeFeb 16th 2015
     
    Agreed with BBSpeed26.

    I love the look of the coater, the supports look good.

    Keep up the good work.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMorganFan
    • CommentTimeFeb 18th 2015
     
    I like the idea of different colors for different tracks but I really like the color scheme as it is. Maybe one dark purple (like you have it now) and one lighter, like violet? Anyway, I am in awe of your supporting prowess.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDonidia
    • CommentTimeFeb 18th 2015 edited
     
    ^^Or possibly a dark red/beige colour.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeFeb 18th 2015
     
    I thought about it but I think it fits the concept of the ride better to just have one color. It's really just one track with 2 stations and the alpha omega thing - the beginning and the end and all - suggests that it's all one I feel.

    I may however do it at one point to show the different layouts :)
    •  
      CommentAuthorbaadrix
    • CommentTimeFeb 18th 2015
     
    Holy twisted mess of steel! This is excellent work, man.

    I'm specifically interested in how the rotation of the seats at that drawn-out hill in the center of the ride will look like, but I'm also looking forward to the rest of the near misses, of course. :D
    • CommentAuthorsprog
    • CommentTimeFeb 18th 2015
     
    I have no idea what is going on in those screenshots but I can't wait to take it for a spin (literally!)
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeMar 14th 2015 edited
     
    Hey folks, it's been a while...

    Unfortunately I was quite sick the last few weeks and couldn't really concentrate on buildung supports for very long. But now I managed to pick up on it again and am happy to show you the progress. I finished the last spaghetti part of the ride and with that I'm like 2/3 done with the supports overall now. Unfortunately the rest will be quite complicated, I hope I can pull it off




    (Please Ignore the messed up track connectors on the left, I've already taken care of them.)





    And here's a bonus teaser pic of the only part of the ride you haven't really seen yet with very WIP supports.
    •  
      CommentAuthorhappyman
    • CommentTimeMar 14th 2015
     
    that looks awesome!
    •  
      CommentAuthorbaadrix
    • CommentTimeMar 16th 2015
     
    You manage to impress me with every update. It's astonishing you can keep track of the supports, I'm already lost just by looking at the pictures. Good luck with the last ones, though!
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJun 15th 2015
     
    This is still alive. I wanted to post when I'm done supporting, but I had really little time on my hands to do so. However, I made it to ~95% and hope I can show more and start landscaping and theming soon. Sadly, I dont have a valid 3ds Max license at the moment since the one from university expired, so I gotta come up with something else. We'll see..



  5.  
    nice!
  6.  
    How do you do the clearance bar at the front of the train?
    • CommentAuthorsprog
    • CommentTimeJun 15th 2015
     
    Wow, I'm impressed you've actually managed this - I wouldn't have a clue where to start!
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      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJun 16th 2015
     
    And I really had none most of the time :D

    ^^ try searching for "Clearance envelope", there should be lots of explanations around. As far as I remember you only need to pick the clearance envelope object from your scenery library and place it anywhere near your train. It connects by itself when you start up the simulator.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJun 28th 2015
     
    •  
      CommentAuthorskyasaurus
    • CommentTimeJun 28th 2015
     
    wow
    •  
      CommentAuthorMorganFan
    • CommentTimeJun 28th 2015 edited
     
    Posted By: UtahCoasterRiderHow do you do the clearance bar at the front of the train?

    He reversed the trains.

    Also, wow.
  7.  
    That would be one expensive set of coasters xD
    I really like them though. Very unique concept, and the supports are really well done considering the layout.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJun 29th 2015
     
    Posted By: MorganFan
    He reversed the trains.


    Oh, THATs what the question was about :D didn't really catch that, almost forgot I did that like a year ago.
  8.  
    Posted By: zampanoAnd I really had none most of the time :D

    ^^ try searching for "Clearance envelope", there should be lots of explanations around. As far as I remember you only need to pick the clearance envelope object from your scenery library and place it anywhere near your train. It connects by itself when you start up the simulator.


    Thanks. It worked.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeAug 9th 2015 edited
     
    Okay, so I got a bit lazy lately with that project and spent the little NL2 time I can get mostly with contests (Back to the roots and Coaster X, more on these soon) and the Job Offer from TATA some of you have also applied for. The latter is almost finished, too, and I'm gonna ask if I may show some of it to you as soon as it is. However, I got a little into scripting and worked with some scenery for the first time since NL1. Really complex stuff going on in NL2, but I'm getting quite inspired by the possibilites.

    In between all these things I worked a little bit on some layouts and projects of my own and decided to convert this thread to a place for all my stuff, since I don't feel like opening another one for each new coaster that I probably won't finish very soon :D
    So I wanted to show you some of that stuff and I'm starting with a Premier Spaghetti Bowl Coaster.



    I've alway been fascinated by those layouts that manage to fit a long and intense ride into such small spaces like Rock'n'Rollercoaster, Flight of Fear/Jokers Jinx or Space Mountain at Disney Paris and always wanted to build a decent spaghetti layout myself. Over the years I repeatedly experienced just how hard that is. Most efforts turned out to either not be compact enough or lacked excitement in the second half. As I got more comfortable with FVD++, a few weeks ago I thought I'd give it another go. And a little bit to my own suprise, after 15-20 Iterations I ended up with a Layout that I actually like quite a lot.

    Have an Overview:

    Mine's on the left, Phyter's Flight of Fear recreation on the right as reference


    My layout ended up beeing taller and having an overall bigger scale after I decided to have the train dive into the layout.
    The ride itself are about 1300 m/4265 ft of track divided into 3 block segments like R'n'RC while FotF has only 2.


    After reaching the top speed of about 105 kmh/65 mph you get thrown into a huge sea serpent. I love those and think that its the perfect way to start spaghetti layout - much like R'n'RC.


    An inverted tophat and wide vertical loop later, the train begins to ascend to the first mcbr, but only after a nice kick of airtime. Second Block is basically a long downward spiral, followed by a directional change at the bottom and a steep upward curve into a suprise heartline roll. The final part is what gave me the biggest headache, so little room left to work with!


    After countless hours I actually managed to squeeze in a small twisty airtime pop and a tight dive into the final inversion, a corkscrew (FotF anyone?). Just another small hop over the launch track and it's over.

    the whole time, I kept checking the clearance, but it got really time consuming and difficult to judge as soon as I had different blocks to check against each other. At one point, I got so annoyed that I started thinking about other, easier ways and came up with a quite simple variation of phyter's custom crosstie script utilising a reproduction of the NL2 original clearance envelope.

    And yes, it passes the test ;)

    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeAug 9th 2015 edited
     
    (Post was too long)

    Okay, so now I can start not building supports for that ;D

    Since I love a good indoor coaster, especially the original version of Disneyland Paris' Space Mountain, which had the best storyline and athmosphere ever and still remains in my absolute favourite rides of all time, I might actually try to think of ways and settings to add to the excitement without putting the whole track in a dark cube with nothing to see. But I'm not sure what to do with it yet. To be continued...
  9.  
    The layout looks really nice but I'm most interested in the clearance script! Did you just replace the crosstie object with a custom (based off the NL2 object) clearance object? And where can I get a hold of Phyter's original script? Nice job with it, really clever way to make clearance checking both easier and more accurate.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2015 edited
     
    Thank you, I used a single .dae object containing several hundreds of these clearance objects.

    You can find the original script here. However I may go ahead and do some more types of clearance objects and release them for everyone to use..
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2015 edited
     
    Last LRP tests on the 4D

    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2016 edited
     


    Hey people, heres the video link for everyone who hasn't seen it yet or wants to see it again. As I already said many times, I'm very happy to make it to the 7th place with it, especially among all those incredible other rides and very thankfuö for all the incredibly great feedback!

    I thought I might say a thing or too that might interest people who liked my ride. A few people like Mike asked - and it also was a topic on the delightful NLCast - how I made the music and the ride interact so closely. If I understood correctly, someone on the Cast even suspected that the ride was designed along that piece of music. It isn't! Just last Friday I went looking for music for my video. I had something like matrix in mind and had thought about the track "neodammerung", which plays in the matrix 3 finale. When hearing it for further inspection I clicked a few of the other songs and was surprised I had not thought about this one before, "Burly Brawl" from Matrix 2, which I think still is one of the coolest and most iconic tracks from the series. So I took that and the two povs, and it instantly worked. Sure, I had to edit in quite a few places to get the timing right, but I just looped or cut some of the parts and didnt have to mess with the speed of the song oder do odd measures or something. So it was partially dumb luck :D - and partially some structural editing.

    However, yeah, it really took me like forever to get all the timings on the ride right and to optimize the rotations. Especially with the "backwards" trains to start facing forwards, because the rotation control doesn't adapt to that.. It really made my brain hurt sometimes :D
    Joseph said it reminded him of the RCT3 Coaster "Armageddon". I didn't know this one but I immediately watched it and it really is one hell of a crazy ride :D

    About the greenfields and not much going on except for the coaster, you're absolutely right, and thats okay. As I squeezed a few hours per day into the last 2 or 3 weeks to get this finished (I already had more or less accepted that I wouldn't have the time to participate at all, when I saw the Loopy ;D), I started to feel I wanted to go on with that thing after the coaster itself is finished. I already envisioned a few coasters and other attraktions in the woods around that lake near the end parts of the ride. But as the time flew, I decided to just finally finish this thing in itself, believing the ride itself would be convincing enough, even though it absolutely would have been nice. Quite a bit before that, I also already had decided to leave the ride itself fairly blank in terms of theming, because I thought it could and should stand for itself as this epic experience instead of drawing attention to anything other than that - I would not have had the time for any of it anyways. On the last days I really got into trouble so I had to record and edit the whole video within about 20 hours. 60fps recording was tedious on my laptop, and in the end I think I didn't shoot any scenes that are not in the video besides a few bad tries. After all, I'm really perfectly happy with my video and my 7th place :)

    So that's what I'm gonna do. I will soon post the download, when I have managed to optimize a few things. After that, I will go on to my next and even way older main project, and keep this as a side park for some smaller coasters and other attractions. I already played with one idea for an hour or two in FVD :)

    Well, this got too long.
    Here are a few more Screens showing the area around the ride as well as the station building and such. I hope you like em, click on to view full size.

    PS: Which one is your favoride side of the Ride?













  10.  
    This is a fantastic project, and was probably my favourite out of the roundup. I think the only time I've ever made a 4D coaster was back in RCT2, and it took so long and was so much faff I've never made one again haha, so for you to have the patience to build two interlocked ones that are perfectly timed AND with backwards facing trains is just incredible. Well done.

    From initial views of the POV I think my favourite side is Alpha at the minute, but that might change once you've released the park and I can have a proper look around.

    Two questions:
    -Are you planning on using the music as the coasters onboard soundtrack? I hope you are, you've already done all of the music editing already, and it works fantastically well. I've had a copy of Burly Brawl in my itunes for years, they used to use it (don't know if they still do) as the onride track for Samurai at Thorpe Park.

    -Have you thought about adding any cover to the queueline? You've got a huge block of it at the minute, and I think adding some kind of cover from the pretend rain/sun would help to stop it looking like a cattlepen so much.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeJan 7th 2016
     
    Thanks, great to hear that from you! =)


    - Seeing how good the music turned out, I definately am planning to do that. Maybe I'll make Neodammerung or something the area music, if that doesnt scream MATRIX to loud :D Now that you mention it, I remember riding Samurai on my first visit back in 04 I think and yeah, you're right, I do remember hearing it! A memory from the very back of my head, thank you for bringing it back :)

    - Actually I had'n't really thought about stuff like that yet, but I probably should. Hopefully the Q will not be too full though since the capacity should be quite nice ;) .. gotta calculate it next time.
  11.  
    ^ That second point is more of an aesthetic thing to be honest, just because you've got a large area of concrete, I thought it might look nice. Just an idea though.
    •  
      CommentAuthorzampano
    • CommentTimeFeb 3rd 2016 edited
     
    Hey People,
    Mike and Joseph invited me to the NLCast to talk about AlphaOmega, which was a great pleasure!
    You can listen to it here: http://forum.nolimits-exchange.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=4258&page=4#Item_43

    I also talked about an old Project of mine, maybe the biggest one I've ever started. I already hinted it one time or two on the forums, but this time I've just gone ahead and said it. It's a triple dueling coaster.

    It goes by the name of

    Three Evils - The Neverender

    (the Coheed and Cambria coaster)

    And it looks a little somthing like this:
    • CommentAuthornSeven
    • CommentTimeFeb 3rd 2016
     
    OH MY that is some twisted madness!